SCP-2054 / Discussion

This is the discussion related to the wiki page SCP-2054.

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re-initialization

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 01:17

I have re-worked this SCP using suggestions from the crowd. I believe its more substantial and interesting. Of course that for you to decide. I realize I've been using the main list as a sandbox. I will stop doing that.

-EDIT

In light of the uniform nature of the criticism, I have tried to address certain issues. I know its an arduous process, but for those who care to, please have a read through of the edited version.

And thanks for taking an interest =D

-Edit

One thing I'd love to have people's opinion on. Say the torture angle is still too harsh. What would be a more natural time line as far as the Foundation's response?

For instance:
1. initial alarm at the discovery of the two of them
2. quarantine
3. Nancy Y█████ is discovered absent.
3. colleagues commiserate. advocates are appointed to both of them
4. experimentation, medical, physical, psychological, etc.
5. longer term confinement.
6. interrogation….

then what? Or what other stages in between?

Last edited on 16 Mar 2014 18:52 by Requitefahrenheit Show more

Re: re-initialization

RJB_R 13 Mar 2014 02:42

You know you can rewrite without reposing, right? People might accuse you of clearing downvotes.

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Whether you like it or not, history is on our side. We will bury you!

Re: re-initialization

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 07:56

I hadn't realized that. Thanks, Roget.

Francis Willjam 13 Mar 2014 02:47

Needs a sweep through for a few grammar and tone slip-ups (I'm too tired to trust myself to edit anything atm) but I really enjoy this version. You didn't attempt to put forced feels in every sentence but still got across much of the hopelessness of the situation.

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 02:57

Oh thank you very much. This one was 24 hours from cradle to grave. I'm trying to be less perfectionist in my writing.
Thanks again =D

-edit

Thanks also for suggesting the interrogation logs.

Last edited on 13 Mar 2014 07:33 by Requitefahrenheit Show more

wafflesrawsome 13 Mar 2014 03:03

This SCP is really interesting, but it seems to be really similar to SCP-600 in the fact that they both take the forms of other people, but this one does it willingly. It seems cliche, but it has more "addon stuff" than description it's a bit more original.

(account deleted) 13 Mar 2014 03:24

So now, instead of the "let's torture this dude" angle being an afterthought in an otherwise boring article, it's front and center, making this an actively bad article.

Between the completely unrealistic flippant attitudes of people being incarcerated, tortured and mindfucked for what's apparently at least months, the fact that the Foundation is torturing people for no good reason at all, and the dialogue ("this is kafkaesque, no it's more like dostoevsky dohoho"), I've gone from not really caring about this to wanting it off the site.

This one was 24 hours from cradle to grave.

In this case, it's showing.

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 06:44

I appreciate that your response is thoughtful. I'll have to think about that.

Tim Scriven 09 Aug 2014 03:03

I would add to that by saying as Kalinin says that the foundation seems unrealistically hell bent on continuing to apply torture even after it has become clear that it won't work. The flip side of that though is that much of the drama and humanity of the story is related to the Dr's and SCP's experiences surviving torture. Rather than toning down this element, I would suggest providing the Foundation with a stronger rationale to keep trying it.

Also the fact that the foundation freaked out after discovering a "non-zero" probability that they had been infiltrated is absurd. Inferential statistics doesn't work like that.

Djoric 13 Mar 2014 03:47

So basically it doesn't exist.

It's just the Foundation being paranoid.

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 04:29

Well it must exist. There's a duplicate doctor.

-edit

its also implied that it may not know that its the impostor which I think turns the despairing nature of the situation into something somewhat existential. What is it to be an impostor if you react the same as the original. I'm not trying to be grandiose for its own sake…its just what I was attempting.

Last edited on 13 Mar 2014 06:51 by Requitefahrenheit Show more

Deacon_Blues_117 14 Mar 2014 19:53

For that matter, is it the impostor? Or is it in fact the original researcher, still desperately hoping to convince his colleagues that the scip is neutralized?

Requitefahrenheit 15 Mar 2014 10:01

exactly

Dr Hush 13 Mar 2014 04:05

Why would the foundation do these things?

Faced with an apparent duplication, why would it assume some kind of infiltration? The CIA might be paranoid, the FBI might be incompetent, but the foundation can't afford to have unclear motives or sloppy reasoning - and they know it.

Who on the O5 or ethics committee is stupid enough to think torture is a way to get information? The foundation is cold as marble, but it isn't cruel, and it doesn't do pointless things on the off-chance that "Oh well, it might give us information, of some kind, somehow".

The premise is a good one - an old sci-fi staple. And the dialogue is snappy, and I think quite believable. I suggest it would be better as a foundation tale about an investigation into how the affair was mishandled.

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 06:48

My belief is that given the skip has been undercover or masquerading for decades, the Foundation is understandably alarmed about what is probably the greatest security breach in its history.

They're not torturing them for fun. Its essential they 'break' it and get it to reveal everything it knowns, everything it may have done, whatever it in the thrall of, etc. Its also implied that there could well be others of them.

I think I'm depicting the Foundation not as heartless, but simply as ruthless. Not as sadistic, simply desperate.

Pig_catapult 13 Mar 2014 22:45

Except that torture never gives good information. People will say whatever they think their torturer wants to hear, to make the pain stop. It's been documented again and again.

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Piffy is an SCP Foundation Moderator, Lv. 9001 Squishy Wizard, and Knight of the Red Pen.

MarqFJA87 10 Mar 2019 00:01

I know, responding to a very old post, but this needs to be said.

This is a setting where things that violate natural laws not only exist, but are implicitly quite commonplace away from the eyes of the general populace. And the Foundation regularly makes use of science and technology that is either explicitly anomalous in nature or is simply far more "advanced" than what modern-day human society is capable of, such as drugs that make you forget whatever the Foundation wants you to forget (it's often implied that the induced amnesia can be selective). It's not outside the realm of possibility that the Foundation has methods/tools of anomalous/super-advanced nature that genuinely make torture a relatively viable method of interrogation.

Technician Downs 13 Mar 2014 08:58

I upvoted, but it could be better as a tale.

Wilhelm Klink 13 Mar 2014 09:14

Seemingly needless torture aside, good article. I like the idea of questioning whether you are the original or the copy.

InsipidParoxysm 13 Mar 2014 12:24

Upvoted.

Definitely improved from last attempt.

Litfried 13 Mar 2014 14:38

Now, I really like this one, because the main hook of 'are you the real one or not' is one that I particularly enjoy (and employed in one of my own SCPs - SCP-1536 if you're interested), and the dialogue was also very good.

I went through and made quite a few minor edits for punctuation in the dialogues, so please check to make sure I haven't overstepped. I also edited your footnote to use Wikidot syntax, and finally altered the chess notation to have lower-case square references (as per en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algebraic_chess_notation).

Last note: the medal I've heard used most (especially posthumously) is the Foundation Award for Valour - although as there's no canon please feel free to ignore it if you prefer.

edit: forgot my own SCP number!

Last edited on 13 Mar 2014 14:41 by Litfried Show more

Requitefahrenheit 13 Mar 2014 17:27

I'm glad you line it and thanks for the edits. By the way. I'm going to keep the thaumiel Medal of Honor. I just like te way it sounds. I look forward to looking at your own skip. =D

imperfectRegulator 24 Mar 2014 20:29

I personally like the little rozencrantz and guildinstien tidbit in the converstions they had,

Requitefahrenheit 25 Mar 2014 04:17

thanks. nothing wrong with a little Stoppard

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