qntm's proposal / Discussion

This is the discussion related to the wiki page qntm's proposal.

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Some hints!

qntm 23 Sep 2010 22:46

• Young's Cabinet of Curiosities resembles a less dangerous prototypical SCP Foundation (as did all of that era really)
• The universe is an SCP
• The universe is a secure containment protocol created by some higher organisation to keep something within it under containment
• Whatever that thing is, we're trapped in here with it
• It could be the SCPs themselves
• Or something else we haven't observed yet
• Or SCP-001-A specifically
• Or something inside SCP-001-A (two layers of containment)
• Or us
• in reality, the cosmic microwave background found by WMAP was almost totally flat and uniform… this is because the real pattern has been suppressed by the Foundation!!
• SCP-001-A and SCP-001-B could be the same object (SCP-001-A contains the universe)
• Opening SCP-001-A is probably an incredibly bad idea which is why Hack stopped the experiments
• Then he was killed by Mirski
• Then the experiments resumed
• Who the HELL has that key?
• Probably one of the Foundation's enemies
• Letting the key reach the lock is probably another incredibly bad idea
• Which is why the Foundation is trying to find it - just to make sure… but make sure of what?

Last edited on 23 Sep 2010 22:58 by qntm Show more

Re: Some hints!

MalcolmMacLean 26 Sep 2010 14:19

I admit that it's rather early in the morning where I am, and I'm not known for being unusually perceptive at the best of times, but I didn't see ANY of that in the article.

Re: Some hints!

Rejekyll 26 May 2012 15:01

Although this is an old post and I'm not sure if the author is still active, can we get this in a collapsible? Thanks.

Re: Some hints!

EFS19 - MC_Kejml 12 Sep 2012 13:55

Man, you have no idea how much I like this list of ideas. If only all SCPs had these ideas by the author for the slow thinkers like me…

tunedtoadeadchannel 23 Sep 2010 22:57

"fist sized" is emphatically not a scientific unit of measurement. Fix that.

Sophia Light 26 Sep 2010 07:40

Hmm
Possible idea for further creep:
While perhaps it's first found in the background radiation thing, the pattern starts showing up in other things as well, more and more as time goes on. Sure, it's all very well that the same pattern that's on the lock shows up faintly in the universe's background radiation, but when the same one also starts appearing in the irregularities in planets' orbits, pi, and the human genome, you start wondering whether it's just showing up as you measure more things, or whether it's the fact that we're processing more data that's causing it to appear more, or whether someone is trying to tell us something. I have this vivid mental image of a high-tech random number generator (either foundation or civilian, one or multiple) having to be removed from use because they start simply repeating the pattern, endlessly, instead of normal output. Maybe it's happened multiple times and becoming more frequent.

Anyways, this might be a craptastic idea, and if so, I apologize for my lack of sleep. Just popped into my head.

DrMagnus 26 Sep 2010 14:09

I like the concept, but it took me a LONG time to get anywhere near what the thing actually does. Or doesn't do. It's all based on reader inference. It's good, and well written, but a bit unclear. A picture would help immensely, in my opinion.

GabTheGreat 10 Oct 2010 18:39

About the picture, "onyx egg" turned up some interesting pictures. Maybe someone with photoshop skills (e.g. Not me) could modify one to add the pattern. And also, this SCP deserves a place in the "normal" list if it doesn't get accepted.

Dexanote 30 Sep 2010 20:48

Wait. The universe is locked within the item? Is this like the box on Futurama with our own universe in it? I'm terribly confused.

Dr Lowman 01 Oct 2010 01:06

That's one of the suggested possibilities.

Slight changes

qntm 03 Oct 2010 21:32

I've made some slight changes to the page.

• The onyx gemstone now weighs much less (and the hollow space inside it is logically much bigger i.e. the whole thing is hollow)
• SCP-001-A emits microwave radiation just like SCP-001-B is itself a pattern of microwave radiation
• The Sumerian script is no longer infinitely long (this doesn't actually give us anything or make it scarier), but finite
• The script is now explicitly identified as probably being a "spell of containment" i.e. an SCP protocol
• The fact that SCP-001-B is an identical spell of containment is explicitly stated.

I've been having real trouble with figuring out exactly how much to make explicit and how much to leave implicit. Some people are really good at figuring stuff out from hints and some people aren't. Dropping good hints has never been my strong suit :-/

Re: Slight changes

Techhead 01 Nov 2010 01:43

One thing I think the article needs is a little more expansion on the key. It seems that for something like this, the Foundation would either be looking for it, or include a reason in their report why they aren't.
Also, on something like patterns hidden in physical constants of the universe, I wouldn't expect to see it in pi. I would find said pattern in the fine-structure constant. (Expressed in Planck units) My reason is that the SCP shows anomalies mainly electromagnetic in nature, so the dimensionless physical constant related to electromagnetism would be the place to look.

Re: Slight changes

Dr Grim 01 Nov 2010 20:34

Pi is an irrational number, so it's infinitely long. Even if the pattern is also infinitely long, it would show up eventually, guaranteed. Admittedly, it might take a while to find, but it would be there.

As to your first point, I agree. The Foundation would presumably be doing everything they could to find the key, either to open the box, or to keep it closed.

Re: Slight changes

zaratustra 01 Nov 2010 22:30

Pi is an irrational number, so it's infinitely long. Even if the pattern is also infinitely long, it would show up eventually, guaranteed. Admittedly, it might take a while to find, but it would be there.

Not necessarily. You can have a pile infinite apples, each different in size and shape, but that doesn't necessarily imply you can find a orange in the pile.

For example, take the number:

0.1011011101111011111011111101111111…

It is irrational, infinitely long, and never repeats - however, you'd never find the sequence 1001 in there.

Re: Slight changes

Dr Grim 01 Nov 2010 23:46

Aaaaand my limited grasp of mathematics is shown.

SAVING THROW!

That fraction of yours can be written as 1/9 - 1/10² - 1/10⁵ - 1/10⁹ - …, or 1/9 - 1/10² - 1/10⁽²⁺³⁾ - 1/10^(2+3+4) - … Since that's the sum of an infinite series (assuming I'm remembering correctly), that should make it representable as some sort of fraction, which ought to make it rational.

Re: Slight changes

zaratustra 02 Nov 2010 16:39

YOU TRIGGERED MY TRAP CARD!

pi is the sum of an infinite series too :D

pi = 4/1 - 4/3 + 4/5 - 4/7 + 4/9 - 4/11 + 4/13 - 4/15 + …

Re: Slight changes

Dr Grim 02 Nov 2010 17:51

The trap card attacks my life points directly, I drop down to zero. You win this round.

Re: Slight changes

Lantern2814 19 Jan 2015 21:05

Yeah, because Dr.King made that pile of apples.

Re: Slight changes

qntm 05 Nov 2010 17:01

I don't remember mentioning anything about patterns hidden in physical constants of the universe?

Re: Slight changes

Techhead 09 Nov 2010 07:11

Sorry, that was Sophia Light's idea that I elaborated on.

Photosynthetic 02 Nov 2010 16:50

How did the Foundation discover that this 001-A was anomalous in the first place? It was acquired in 1980, before the microwave background pattern was discovered, and its only *obvious* anomalous characteristic is its indestructibility. For all that a vacationing Foundation staff member would be able to tell from viewing it on display, it'd just look like a particularly exquisite piece of ancient craftsmanship — or even a modern forgery, if he knew enough to be suspicious of the fine detail approaching the "lock".

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SCP Wiki Administrator | Earth: We're all in this together.

qntm 05 Nov 2010 17:03

You're right, the timeline here doesn't make any sense. Why would a gilded onyx be the first item in the SCP collection?

Come to think of it, shouldn't any proposal for SCP-001 necessarily be the first and oldest SCP? I need to think about this.

Dr Caldwell 26 Nov 2010 17:31

the infinate pattern perhaps?

Photosynthetic 27 Nov 2010 04:38

The human eye doesn't have resolution fine enough to tell that it's infinite, and they wouldn't have been close enough to it with other equipment to notice anything amiss.

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SCP Wiki Administrator | Earth: We're all in this together.

Dr Lowman 27 Nov 2010 08:31

Maybe Young's "Cabinet of Curiosities" contained other known SCPs, and this was investigated just in case.

zaratustra 30 Nov 2010 11:47

oh [i]shiiiiiiiiiiiiit[/i]

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2010/11/recycled-universe/

Photosynthetic 30 Nov 2010 17:03

Huh. I've never heard of a partial containment breach before, but at least they didn't get the full resolution. MTF γ-5 has some explaining to do.

Seriously, though, that's just cool. Loop quantum gravity gets more plausible every time I hear about it. :D

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SCP Wiki Administrator | Earth: We're all in this together.

Last edited on 30 Nov 2010 17:04 by Photosynthetic Show more

Kickassfrog 11 Apr 2011 19:04

The thing that throws me is the business with the key
The foundation possesses a key that opens basically anything, would they not use that for testing?
You might want to include either an entry for that and why it didn't work, or an entry for why it's use was denied

Drewbear 11 Apr 2011 19:33

Cross-testing is discouraged these days, as items should generally stand or fall on their own.

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Giving bearhugs to the unsuspecting since 1872.

IYellalot 15 Apr 2011 16:31

Really scary once you realize that this might very well contain our own universe.

What's even scarier is that there's something that convinced the Foundation to continue trying to break it.

Whatever that thing is, ending the universe is preferable to letting that thing happen.

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